HS #256 Teaching Our Children to Know God’s Voice with Wendy Speake and Mark Batterson
Links and Resources:
Show Notes:
Mark Batterson is the New York Times bestselling author of seventeen books, including Whisper, Chase the Lion, and The Circle Maker. He is the lead pastor of National Community Church. Mark and his wife, Lora, have three children and live on Capitol Hill.
Why is God whispering so you barely hear?
It’s really quite simple: you have to get near!
(God Speaks in Whispers)
“You can’t be a perfect parent, but you can be a praying parent.” (Mark Batterson)
“Prayer turns parents into prophets who shape the lives of their kids.” (Mark Batterson)
“We have the powerful privilege of pronouncing blessing over our children.” (Mark Batterson)
“The days are long but the years are short.” (Anonymous)
The Batterson’s Four Family Values
- Gratitude
- Generosity
- Humility
- Courage
Resources:
God Speaks in Whispers https://amzn.to/3kiWBdc
... Circle Maker https://amzn.to/3c2h1V5
... Circles Around Your Children https://amzn.to/3km8RK8
... the Lion https://amzn.to/33Ax8VO
... the Man
Triggers: Exchanging Parents’ Angry Reactions for Gentle Biblical Responses
Show Transcript:
HS EP 256
Wendy -
Hello and welcome back to another installment of the Homeschool Solutions Show. My name is Wendy Speake, and I am one of the many hosts we have here on the podcast. Each week, you'll hear from one of us, inviting one of our friends to join for a conversation about this busy, blessed season as we educate our children at home.
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And now. On to today's show.
Well, welcome back everybody. I haven't done an interview here on the podcast in a while, but I could not pass up this incredible opportunity to sit down with New York Times best selling author, Mark Batterson. Today, we are going to be talking about teaching our children to know God's Voice. Mark, and his daughter, Summer, recently released a children's book entitled, God Speak in Whispers. Mark Batterson is already the author of seventeen books, including Whisper, which is for us, the parents, Chase the Lion, and my personal favorite, The Circle Maker. He is the lead pastor of National Community Church and Mark and his wife, Laura have grown children, and are now enjoying being empty-nesters. And they live on Capitol Hill in Washington, DC.
He is a busy guy. We only have him for a short time today, so let's jump right into the conversation. Welcome to the Homeschool Solutions Show, Pastor Mark Batterson.
Mark -
Ah, Wendy, thank you so much. It's so good to be with you and, along with our three kids, I might add that we're about to add a puppy dog, so, there is that. There are a lot of, shall we say, COVID puppies that have been added to families. And so our family's gonna grow by one, here, in just a couple of days.
W -
Yeah, that's fun. We added eleven chickens and a duck. No dogs.
M -
That's a little more exotic. That's pretty cool.
W -
It's been pretty exciting, and we could sit and talk a whole hour about that adventure. But, that's not what today is about. So, Mark can we dive in. Tell us about the inception of your new children's picture book, God Speaks in Whispers, that you co-wrote with your daughter, Summer. I'd love to talk about that, too, but for just now, how did this book come to be?
M -
Yeah. Well, I wrote a book called Whispers, that you referenced, and, you know, it's about hearing the voice of God, that still small voice, through Scripture. But also through doors and dreams and desires and people and promptings, and in that language of pain that we don't like so much. But, God speaks in all of those different ways, and I wanna make sure that that still small voice is the loudest voice in my life. And so I wrote that book for big people like us, and then we had this idea, boy, that would be a great subject matter for kids. And, you know, isn't it funny, Wendy, that kids have an easier time learning second languages than us. And so, part of me thinks that, in some ways, children have a unique advantage when it comes to hearing that still small voice. But I would also say that as parents we need to help them learn to discern that voice, almost like this spiritual father, Eli, with the prophet Samuel when he was just a little boy.
W -
Oh, that's beautiful. Yes, I had an experience with my oldest child when he was probably, I'm gonna guess, somewhere between nine and ten. He was reading through the action Bible. Do you know what I'm talking about? That action Bible, and he was taking such ownership of being his own leader in his pursuit of knowing God and His Word, he loved it. And he read through it three or four times. But he was probably more familiar with Bible stories than I was at that point because he had been consuming them. You know, me, it takes a couple of years to get through the Bible. He was doing it in nine or ten months, and then just immediately starting again.
But I remember he had a bad dream. A bad experience one night. Not a dream, actually. I mean, he was being...definitely pursued and taunted by the evil one. It was not nice. And he came to me. He said, Mom, I'm hearing a voice and I know it's not God's. He knew what God's voice sounded like and he had a very Eli-like moment when he was even younger than that. But, he was able to come and say, I heard a voice, and I know it's not God's, and I know this is really about knowing God's voice. But one of the benefits of teaching our children to know God's voice, in this culture, any culture, any generation, is being able to hear and know when it's a counterfeit voice that is not in line with God's voice in my life, as His sheep know His Voice, and that's not it.
M -
Ah, that's so good. I think there was a sermon in there, Wendy.
W -
I know, I'm covered in goosebumps right now.
M -
It's spot on because, you know, Scripture says, don't be unaware of the enemy's schemes. And he's an accuser and a liar and an angel of light. And so often, kinda comes at us with these tactics or schemes, but I think you're spot-on. You know, my sheep hear my voice, they know my voice. And so, really learning to discern the voice of God. In fact, here's a good example. You know, the conviction of the Holy Spirit is a beautiful thing. It's a wonderful thing. It's when we feel guilt over unconfessed sin. And we've gotta...it's like pain. We've gotta figure out, okay, I better do something to remedy this. Condemnation is feeling guilt over confessed sin. So, it's forgiven and forgotten, and what the enemy will do, will try to remind us of everything we've done wrong. And so, even little distinctions like that, is this the conviction of the Holy Spirit or is it the condemnation of the enemy.
And kids are...they...I know that they're young, but they are sometimes more discerning than we give them credit for.
W -
Yeah, yeah, and out of the mouths of babes, right? We hear it ourselves. That's the truth.
Okay, so, I wanna know, because I have these three young boys in my own home, teens and preteens, and they've always got ideas. I mean, we're kind of an entrepreneurial family. And I think there's some catchphrase when it's ministry, like ministry-preneurial. I don't know. It's something, but we're always brainstorming at the table, oh we should do this, oh we could do that. And I want my kids to take ownership and have experiences while they're still under my roof, so I've been looking forward to finding out about, you doing something with a kid. I mean, she was a college graduate, but still, one of your kids. Can you tell us, what was it like to collaborate with your daughter on this book?
M -
Ah. It was so, so real, because, Wendy, some of my very best memories are reading to Summer when she was a little girl. And, by the way, I would always say to her, if all the little girls in the world were lined up and I could only choose one to be my daughter, I would choose you. And so that was kinda our little thing, and I loved reading books. And then I would usually bust out one of those old eighties worship songs, and...
W -
They're the best, man!
M -
You plop 'em into bed, and those are sacred moments. But then, to flip the script, and to write a book together, and then to discover that your daughter has, like, a poetic gene, where she can rhyme words...
W -
Oh, that's special.
M -
The rhyming in the book is all Summer, and she's a recent college graduate. And she studied social work, so it really helps her be dialed in with even some of the mental or emotional challenges that kids face. And so, you know, she's not a mom, she's a social worker, but to be able to collaborate together as father and daughter was really, really special.
W -
That is special. My husband used to make up stories with the boys. We do lots of camping and being outdoors together, and it was always that he would come across, in his stories, a duck-billed beaver tailed bear. And so, there were stories about a duck-billed beaver tailed bear, and then when I told the stories, they were about three brothers that would go on camping trips by themselves, without their parents, which of course, was very cool. And their names were Oomba, Zoomba, and Doomba. So, I mean, I love that you're telling stories, and S. D. Smith, who wrote The Green Ember series, his bestselling books for children, they were just the stories he would tell to his kids. So, it's really neat, and you are speaking to an audience of parents who already have bought into being present, being intentional, pouring into not just their entertainment, but their spiritual development, as we entertain them, woo them, towards the Gospel, towards the Person of Christ. So, I mean, you've got, you had us at hello. So, you wrote a book entitled Whisper, How to Hear the Voice of God. Can you tell us about that book and how this children's book, then, goes the next step and allows us to introduce it? You've told us a little bit, but how do we, then, take the next step and invite our children to learn with us? And as a by-product of us growing to hear God's Voice.
M -
Yeah, maybe I can share just a couple of really practical thoughts on that front. You know, prayer...sometimes we think about that as the words that we speak to God. But there's also listening prayer and that's where we allow God to speak to us. And I would say, first and foremost, through Scripture, and then the Holy Spirit quickens His Word, and so, let me say this. This is for someone listening. God loves the sound of your voice. You have a unique voiceprint, just like you have a unique fingerprint. And in some strange sense, I feel like someone needed to hear that right now. That God loves the sound of your voice. Just like you love the sound of your children's voices. But I think sometimes, we're so quick to fill all of those empty spaces with our words. And let's be honest, what God has to say to us is a little bit more important than what we have to say to God. And so, as a parent, I certainly wanna pray for my kids. In fact, I turn Luke 2:52 into a blessing, may you grow in wisdom and stature and in favor with God and with man. And I pronounced that over my kid's thousands of times.
W -
Are they super tall kids?
M -
You know what. You know what's funny? We just dropped out 18-year-old off at college and he just passed me up, and I'm 6'3". And so, he's got some...
W -
You're not short.
M -
No. And, you know what? I started praying...I'm gonna lose it right now. I started praying that over him. As we're on the way to the airport, and I look in the rearview mirror, and there's just...I see this six-year-old all over again. As he knows what's coming. The blessing is being pronounced on his life, and so, listen Moms, and Dads, we have this powerful privilege of pronouncing blessing. And so let's do it. Let's pronounce that blessing. But then, then Wendy, I would flip the script and I would say it's so important to let our kids find their own voice and verbalize their own prayers. And then, even teach them, hey, let's be, let's be still and know that He is God, Psalm 46. Let's make sure that we're stopping and we're listening. Well, how do you do that? Here's one really practical way. Gratitude is one of our four family values.
And so, my wife and I keep a gratitude journal. Well, kids can keep a gratitude journal. You know, it's gonna be in their own form or fashion, but you know, that's one way that I think we help our kids learn to recognize the voice of God, by seeing the blessings that are all around them.
W -
That's a good one. Hey, can I, just as a little detour here, you can't say, we got four family values and then run on past that. So, what are your four family values?
M -
Yeah. It really does start with gratitude, and then, second family value is generosity. You know, God doesn't bless us to raise our standard of living, He blesses us to raise our standard of giving, and so, we live by this little mantra, flip the blessing. So whenever anybody blesses me, whether it's with words, or kindness, or even a gift card, I'm gonna find a way to flip that blessing for someone else. And then the third one is humility. That, if we stay humble and stay hungry, there's nothing that God can't do in us or through us. And so, as a family, we wanna operate in this spirit of humility. And then, finally, courage.
And, you know, the first book I wrote, Wendy, was In a Pit with a Lion on a Snowy Day. And I dedicated that book to my children. And my prayer for them was that they would grow up to be lion chasers, that they wouldn't run away from the things that they're afraid of, but that they would learn to run to the roar, and, so courage is kind of that fourth piece to the puzzle. And I'll throw in this one other thing. Those came out of a year of discipleship that I did with my oldest son. He was twelve turning thirteen, and we did a discipleship covenant. And then part of that was discerning our values. And then we did a little rite of passage at the end of it. And no matter what age your kids are, it's never too late to kinda walk them through that process. And, we probably don't have time for me to spell that out, but I share a little bit of that in Play the Man, kinda some of that process that I walked through with my sons and with our daughter.
W -
Okay, and we will link to Play the Man and really, all the books that we're mentioning here in the show notes today, so, or just, for goodness sakes, get on Amazon. Type in Mark Batterson. Read what they're about. This is one of our clearest communicators, not just of the Gospel in front of congregations, but just of applying the Gospel to our everyday lives, to our parenting, to our living, to our seeking God, to our finding Him, cause man, there's the promise.
So, but I do want to make sure we share a bit of this book with our listeners today. So, I'm gonna read this, I dare say, poetic, children's book. Just a little bit of it right now. Are you guys ready? Here we go.
Where in the world is God's voice found? Can you hear God crashing in the waves? Can you hear Him echo in the caves? Do you hear him when a bird chirps? Or when your sister slurps? Can you hear Him on top of a mountain? Or even at the drinking fountain. Do you hear God's voice when you're feeling sad? Or maybe when you're a little mad. God speaks through stars that shoot through the sky. God speaks in whispers as soft as a sigh. Why is God whispering so you barely hear? It's really quite simple. You have to get near. Sort of like grandma who gives you a hug, or tucks you in bed nice and snug. God whispers down deep to the depths of your heart. I've been with you from the very start.
Goodness, isn't that a message for all of us to hear and remember? But it's hard to read those and not giggle. I love that it's not just love, above...I mean, you said that she has a poetic gene, but she has a delightful sense of humor too. You guys have done a wonderful job with this script of illustrations by Benetta Capriotti, is that correct?
M -
Yeah.
W -
Or beautiful, it's engaging, it's short enough for very young children. But it's one of those that if you have multiple aged children, let the older ones be around when you're reading it to the younger ones, and keep talking about the priority of being quiet enough to listen. We're told in Zephaniah that God is delighting over us, with just these songs of delight. With love songs for us. Can you believe He's doing that even now? And yet, we're unaware of it, most of the time, because our lives are so loud. We always have this white noise going, almost, whether it's a play by play of music in the background, Alexa, or you know, play my worship playlist. Well, that's great, except it is possible that even our worship music is getting in the way of hearing from the One that we're worshipping. Isn't that the truth?
Okay, so I know that you've got one of those days where you're getting ready for a sermon, Mark, and you've got other podcasts lined up. So, what can you leave us with? We are moms that want to do our very best to make the most of every opportunity, not just to teach our kids reading, writing, and arithmetic. But, the love of the Lord, the knowledge of the Lord, the delighting joyful presence of the Lord. And yet, we can grow tired. We just need you to freshly encourage us and say keep going. Here, do this, bless you with that. Give us something.
M -
Yes, yes. Well, you get to the end of the day and you're so tuckered out that all you wanna do is tuck the kids in bed and kinda quickly flip that switch, but you know, with...as someone who has kids who are a little older, we all know that the days are long, but the years are short. And those moments when we're tucking our kids into bed, they're sacred moments. And so, Wendy, what I envisioned...there was a moment when I was five and I asked my mom if I could ask Jesus into my heart. It was one of those bedtime moments. And my memories are of my parents reading Bible stories to me. And it planted seeds of faith in my life that even now, are bearing fruit, as a Pastor and as a writer and so, I guess my word of exhortation is, it's okay to read Goodnight, Moon, or Moose and a Muffin, and just have fun with it. But, man, when you can have a book that then can turn into, have you ever heard God this way? Or, you know, kids then begin to say, Mom and Dad, how can I hear God's voice? And you create these spiritual conversations. I believe that those are gonna be moments that they're gonna be seeds that are sown, that are going to reap a harvest. And I feel like I should share one last little thing if that's okay.
W -
Yeah, yeah. We'll take you as long as you wanna give us.
M -
Well, you know, I'm not saying anything that anybody doesn't know, but you'll never be a perfect parent. But you can be a praying parent. And prayer really does turn parents into prophets who shape the destiny of their kids. I believe that. And, this is an encouragement for those who have, maybe, been praying a prayer that they don't see the answer. In fact, I call them boomerang prayers, where you pray it and it seems like the answer gets further and further away. That the situation gets worse. Or, the thing you're praying for doesn't seem to change. Or the person that you're praying for just seems to get further and further away. Can I just, can I encourage you, today. Don't give up on God. Keep praying. Keep believing. And I believe that, often, those prayers will boomerang back into our lives. The answers to those prayers, in strange and mysterious ways. In fact, we're seeing it right now, with one of our children. The prayer that I have been praying at the altar, kneeling before God, saying, God, would You do this in their life. And I've been doing that for years. Lots of tears shed. And some of those prayers are boomeranging back right now.
So, don't lose heart. Don't lose faith. Continue to be the Mom or Dad that you've been called to be. And blessings on each and every one of you.
W -
Oh, thank you. I love your encouragement to make the most of these tuck-in times. The first book that I wrote is called Triggers, Exchanging Parent's Angry Reactions for Gentle, Biblical Responses, and we look at 31 common triggers. And not, how do we get our kids to obey us so we don't have to get angry. But, what do we have to learn? How can we grow in the character and the fruit of God's Spirit in our lives? Persevere in doing right, even when our kids are doing wrong, and I did not include this in the book, but one of my triggers, when my kids were young, surprised me so much. It's tuck in. I always thought that that tuck in time was just gonna be a miracle. I mean, you don't have to convince me of how powerful it is. And yet, they ask and they ask for more and more, all day long, and then you finally get, you got this great idea of how you're tucking them in, and you got the Bible story, and you got the supplemental books that are just gonna grow their spirits and connect you, and you're gonna tickle their back and sing blessings. And then, oh, it's just meltdown city, and you just wanna give up. But we've got to not give up. We can't grow weary in doing good. We can't grow weary by the end of the day that we miss that teachable tuck-in time. We just can't.
M -
Yes. Yes. And you know what? I'm seeing this picture, Wendy, of parents kneeling next to their kid's beds and turning it into an altar.
W -
Yes.
M -
And they're...when I used to do father-son nights out with my boys, I very rarely heard an angel choir. There weren't often, like, these moments where, oh, they finally get it. But, isn't it interesting, just recently, I'm with one of my children that I've been praying for. They referenced the way that they would notice me kneel at different moments while I was worshipping or praying. I never thought that made a difference to them. Listen, our kids see it. They notice it. And some of them may pretend that they don't even like it, or that, as a parent, what you're doing on the spiritual front seems silly to them. No, no, no. The day will come where they will understand how significant it is that we are anchored to the Lord Jesus Christ, that we stand on the promises of God's Word. And so, I just, I'm seeing lots of parents turning that bedtime into an altar. Maybe even tonight. And I think that would be an amazing thing, and by the way, I'm gonna go pick up that book, because I, it has to start in the home, right Wendy?
W -
Yeah. Seriously.
M -
In a culture where we're yelling at each other and we're trying to yell over each other. Well, a gentle answer turns away wrath.
W -
Yes.
M -
But that has to start with parents modeling it for their kids. And so.
W -
Yes, so, we're severe, is what we're saying. First, we're in doing right, even when your beloved's do wrong. Persevere, persevere, follow Christ's example, not the children's example. Let Him call us up into maturity, rather than our children calling us down into immaturity. Cause we're gonna sway one way or the other. We can't be that steady. We wanna be more influenced by Christ-likeness than our kid's likeness. Right?
All right, why don't you leave us with a prayer and we'll say goodbye?
M -
Yes. And, let me have a little bit of fun. Can I turn the last two pages of this book into the prayer?
W -
Yeah! Absolutely!
M -
Okay. Here we go. Above all else, know this is true, that God is singing all around you. And by the way, that's Psalm 32:7, He's singing songs of deliverance all around us, all the time, and then here's...here we go, and what is He saying in that voice still and small? That you, my dear, are His favorite of all. God loves you. Guess what? He even likes you. And so, blessings, Wendy, on you, and each and every person listening. What a joy to be with you today.
W -
Thank you, and we like you too, Pastor Mark, so I hope that we will have you back some other time. All right, take care, and thank you.
M -
Thanks. God bless.
W -
Thank you for joining us this week on the Homeschool Solutions Show. As always, you can find show notes and links to all the resources mentioned at homeschooling.mom. I hope you'll take a moment to subscribe to the podcast, and, if it was especially meaningful to you, share it with your friends via email or social media. This is just another way we can all encourage and love and support one another.
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